Here are our Tottenham talking points after the 2-2 draw with Manchester United in the Premier League on Saturday afternoon
There's a fine line between being lauded for game-changing substitutions and acknowledging that those players should have started the match anyway.
That's perhaps the main question surrounding Tottenham's chaotic 2-2 draw against Manchester United in Saturday's early kick-off. For three of Thomas Frank's changes - Wilson Odobert, Destiny Udogie and Mathys Tel - all played a direct role in Spurs' turning the game around but questions will be asked as to why at least one or two of them did not start in the first place.
Frank had dismantled the left-hand side of his team that had impressed in midweek against Copenhagen and replaced it with an unbalanced, clunky one in the right-footed Djed Spence and Richarlison, who is more battering ram than lock picker.
The result was an opening 45 minutes in which Spurs had just three touches in the opposition box, their joint-fewest in a Premier League home game in the past 10 seasons. There was one big chance for Richarlison as he somehow contrived to miss Brennan Johnson's ball on a plate cross for him six yards out.
You know an encounter is dull when the highlight of the first half is a sound the fans made. It came when Micky van de Ven ran past one challenge and 60,000 or so Spurs supporters inside the stadium all went 'ooooh' in unison, expecting another memorable pitch-long run after Tuesday night's special goal.
Unfortunately for everyone involved, it was just the one person beaten by the flying Dutchman this time before he passed the ball to a team-mate. He got excited on another surge forward moments later only to give the ball away.
It was a half of precious little quality from either side. Brennan Johnson bailed out Spence with a sliding challenge in his own box to prevent Amad Diallo running through to goal after the Spurs full-back had sliced a clearance towards his own area and then messed up trying to head the resulting bouncing ball.
The lack of quality mirrored the Europa League final in Bilbao in May, only this time it was United who broke the deadlock with a scruffy goal on 32 minutes. Pape Matar Sarr had all the time in the world in the Tottenham box to clear the ball or pass it to someone in space.
Instead he fired it at Van de Ven about three yards from him and the Dutchman sent his attempted clearance against a United player. The ball eventually fell to Amad who lifted a cross to the back post and Frank's former Brentford man Bryan Mbeumo headed home unchallenged by both Pedro Porro or Johnson while Guglielmo Vicario simply watched the ball sail past him.
There was a certain irony that it was Mbeumo, for Frank adores the Cameroon international, believing he is a complete winger and the best of people on the pitch as well as off it in the team environment.
The Dane attempted to get the 26-year-old to join Tottenham in the summer during one chat not long after he joined himself, but Mbeumo's dream move was already locked in to United. Now the Premier League Player of the Month was scoring against his former manager at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium.
There was little else of note in a first half that ended in a smattering of boos from the home fans, other than Randal Kolo Muani taking an elbow to the jaw from Harry Maguire just 12 minutes in which left its mark and led to the Frenchman coming off at half-time.
"He actually struggled a little bit, but nothing big," said Frank after the game. Reports in France suggest the forward will undergo scans on Sunday but there is little concern over the severity of the knock at this stage.
When it came to jaws though, there were around 60,000 of them dropping when it was announced that it was Kolo Muani coming off for Odobert rather than Richarlison. The fans were not aware of the Frenchman's pain and only aware of the discomfort the Brazilian's struggling showing had caused them.
At least in Odobert, there was a game changer entering the action. The Frenchman would go on to grab an assist, create the most chances of the game with three carved out, complete more take-ons than any other player (2), complete 100 per cent of his passes and win 100 per cent of his duels.
While the 20-year-old might blow away in a strong breeze, he does have a driving style with the ball and he is full of confidence right now, which made the decision to bench him all the more surprising.
"We tried to work around what is the best way to attack the opponent in front of us, and at the same time still keep a little bit of flow," Frank said in trying to explain that decision afterwards.
"We wanted two strikers, Kolo Muani and Richarlison, for the crosses, which we thought was an area where we potentially could hurt United. I think it worked perfectly with the first one, where Richarlison got a big chance, so that could have been an unbelievable, fantastic game plan from us.
"So that was part of it, and we need different personalities and types for different games."
On Odobert's performance, he added: "He's positive. I think he's stepping forward, or stepping up, and doing things that look right."
You can forgive Frank for using the term 'stepping forward' because it's his most used phrase right now for players recovering from those mysterious minor knocks at Tottenham that always require more time than expected to recover from.
Mohammed Kudus is the latest victim in missing the past two matches after it was said that he should be back for this game.
As for Odobert, he started to show what he could have brought during that dull first half. Within nine minutes he curled in a great cross that Cristian Romero flicked towards goal only for United goalkeeper Senne Lammens to get a leg to. Soon after Joao Palhinha hooked a shot towards goal that Lammens pushed away.
The unmarked Odobert would have then likely scored for Tottenham if Richarlison had played a pass left to him rather than right to the clearly offside Johnson, who ran on and scored but always expected the flag to be raised.
Destiny Udogie entered the fray for Pedro Porro, who struggled with his delivery all day and Spence duly switched to the right where he looked better. Porro would later reply on Instagram to a fan who said he had not had the best day: "I know this, don ‘t worry the best moments is coming..."
Udogie not starting was more understandable because the Italian has only recently returned after more knee issues, so not pushing him to a second game within a few days would have been recommended by the sports science staff.
The 22-year-old has not been called up to the Italy squad for the coming international break, which should allow him to focus on his strengthening work for the games to come and Spurs will be better for it.
Udogie would make his mark in this game but only after Frank's next set of changes made some noise.
Rodrigo Bentancur replaced Palhinha and then Mathys Tel came on for Xavi Simons, sparking loud boos from the majority of the 61,210 fans inside the stadium. The boos were not for Tel, but for the withdrawal of Spurs' sole playmaker Xavi.
The Dutchman had shown glimpses of his ability with a James Maddison-like ability to turn and swerve away with the ball from close markers, albeit without too much end product. Maddison was sat in a hospitality box behind the media area working on a different kind of product, alongside Twitch streamer, YouTuber and Manchester United fan Angryginge with a crossover video on the way.
Down on the pitch, Frank's changes did the trick. Just five minutes after they were made, Odobert raced into the United half, played the ball out to Udogie and the Italian hit a low cross into the box towards Tel.
The 20-year-old took a touch and turned Matthijs de Ligt superbly and his shot was heading inside the near post only for De Ligt to deflect it inside the other one instead.
It meant Tel has scored twice in his past 145 minutes of Premier League football over four games.
A video Tottenham put out in midweek had shown Tel scoring various clinical goals in training at Hotspur Way and being hyped up every time he did so by some of his fellow French speakers in Odobert and Sarr. That confidence led him to this moment.
The 84th minute goal reconnected the players and the fans after those boos and the crowd were the 12th man for the next seven minutes or so.
"Sometimes you are lucky [with substitutions] but of course every single time I take a decision to sub a player it’s with one aim. To make the team win or get back into the game or try to see the game out," Frank told football.london about the boos for the Xavi withdrawal.
"It’s with only one aim. To try to win the game. Mathys did well, great goal, great involvement and in general I think Xavi did a fine game. A positive but also you need a bit of freshness."
Spurs were also indebted to a brilliant saving challenge from Van de Ven, who raced from behind United sub Benjamin Sesko to make the last-ditch intervention.
Van de Ven is the only player in Europe's top five leagues this season to have scored three or more goals and made two or more last man tackles.
The moment not only prevented a goal as the Slovenian ran through but caused the visiting forward to leave the action with a knee injury after United had used all of their substitutes, meaning the final eight minutes would see Spurs with a numerical advantage.
What everyone thought was the winner came a minute into added time. Tel was involved again as his corner was headed out to Odobert on the edge of the box. The Frenchman hit a curling shot and, played onside by Manuel Ugarte, Richarlison flicked his head out and guided it perfectly into the bottom left corner of the net.
It looked like a fortunate deflection but watch it back in slow motion and the Brazilian meant it with great reactions. It was one of the few moments of quality in his performance on the day but it should have brought all three points.
It did spark wild celebrations, both those hilarious and unexpected. Watch Sarr in the aftermath in particular. The young Senegal midfielder ran after his goalscoring friend, trying to grab him as he was ripping off his shirt.
Sarr then attempted one of the worst forward diving slides ever seen across what was clearly dry grass at that point, meaning he collapsed in a heap, almost bending his right arm at an unnatural position behind him before lying on his back.
It could have looked like Jurgen Klinsmann's famous goal celebration but instead looked like a mess of limbs. Djed Spence at least completed a run, slide and roll with far more panache among the celebrating bodies.
Cristian Romero had gone off by this point and had been stood in the dugout barking out instructions like a coach. The Argentine had been thrown a big coat by Justin Cochrane so he did not get told off by the officials.
Frank described Romero afterwards as "just done physically. He just came back from that injury. He's fine". He certainly looked fine though as he had, after coming off looking injured, surprisingly sprinted up the pitch with Xavi and Porro to clamber all over the goalscorer, with the latter repeatedly kissing the crying Richarlison's head.
Unfortunately the Richarlison shirt off celebration once again cursed Tottenham in that moment. There's an unwritten rule that if the Brazilian whips off his top, not only will he be booked for it but something may go wrong next.
After such shirtless celebrations in his first season at the club, against Fulham, his goal was ruled out by VAR and in the comeback at Anfield later that same campaign, Diogo Jota would score a winner seconds after Richarlison's goal had brought Spurs back level from 3-0 down.
The shirt farewell celebration returned on November 8, 2025, and so did the subsequent pain.
United were awarded a last-gasp corner, sending Lammens up to make an extra man in the box. Bruno Fernandes whipped the ball deep to the back post where De Ligt headed it at goal and Vicario could only get a hand to it after it had crossed the line.
Johnson had been bewilderingly assigned to mark the big De Ligt throughout the game and just lost him in the final moments, getting in a tangle with Van de Ven and Kevin Danso, who were all left stood in a group eventually marking nobody.
Luke Shaw also managed to block both Bentancur and Udogie from getting to the back post, leaving the big Dutchman all alone to head home and break Tottenham hearts in the 96th minute.
Frank played down the exit of Romero in having a role in the defending at the corner.
"His position, he wouldn't have been near the goal anyway, so it's a cross on the side, and then he would have been in the middle zone, so this was back post, so that wouldn't have affected anything," he said.
It was a remarkable end to a dull game. United are a tough watch, a team so far removed from the one that used to dominate English and European football, even if this draw made it four wins and three draws from their past seven matches which is nothing to be sniffed at.
They only had two shots on target though all game and five in total but Ruben Amorim's men still took home a share of the spoils with 10 men.
Spurs had 10 shots at goal with four on target with 97 successful final third passes to United's 52. They took home a point after being behind in the 84th minute but it felt like and was two thrown away.
It did mean Tottenham avoided a fourth home loss of the season but they have still claimed just two points from their past five games at their own stadium in the Premier League.
It also continued a concerning stat that Spurs are winless in their past 18 Premier League games when conceding first, having lost 14 and drawn four, which shows they just cannot find a way back, or have not since been able to since overcoming Aston Villa 4-1 in November last year.
"Of course, the emotions inside me are high but I take the positives out of this game," Frank told football.london. "That’s what I believe and how I believe in building a good team and keep adding layers to it.
"Overall, a fine, good performance against a good Man Utd team which is definitely in flow. We are talking a bit about our level of defensive and attacking threats and to play against a Man Utd side that play with confidence with Cunha, Mbeumo, Amad and Sesko coming on and we kept them to five shots.
"It’s just another example on the other way around that it’s not that easy to create in the Premier League even though they had all their big boys out there."
He added: "Second half I was extremely happy with our response. We are playing at home and of course we all want to win and don't talk too much about home form and all that. I know we need to win before we don’t talk about it.
"The way we turned it around to stay in the game, kept doing the right thing throughout the second half, very happy with that. So close to winning it. On any other day, we win it."
Spurs are still trying to find their way as an attacking unit under Frank and are missing those key creators in Kudus, Maddison and Dejan Kulusevski and a striker in Dominic Solanke who Frank still does not sound utterly convinced is coming back any time soon.
The Dane is still attempting to find the right fit in the attacking areas and the relationships that work.
"Yeah, I think that's fair. We are searching to find the right balance up front, and I think when we look at the game back, I think there was positive bits going forward also from the game," he said. "I think we created one of the biggest chances was Richarlison from a cross from Brennan after, what, five, ten minutes.
"Sometimes the small things. He scores on that instead of Bryan then it changes a little bit and opened up the game a tiny bit more, but we constantly work on the relationships and try to improve it with the players and try to find what is exactly the right blend, but I think there were small steps in the right direction."
The Tottenham players will now mostly go their separate ways for the international break, at least making it two in a row without heading off after a defeat.
The non-internationals will get a few days off during the coming week, which will give Frank and his staff some time to recharge as well and plot what comes next.
Then there will be an U21s training ground friendly which should see Radu Dragusin involved to get some minutes on his comeback. Kota Takai was set to return to training at the start of this month but does not appear to have done so yet. Ben Davies has been included in the Wales squad which suggests he's nearing a return if he doesn't withdraw.
Solanke is not expected to be involved in that training ground friendly although Frank is hoping the striker's ankle improves over the international break, even if he didn't deliver the most confidence-giving answer to a question about whether the England forward will return before the end of the year.
"Er, I do hope so. I would say let’s see what happens after the international break," said the Spurs boss. "We are still going steps forward. It’s on track so far."
Frank needs all the firepower he can get back because after the international break comes the double whammy of the first north London derby of the season at Premier League leaders Arsenal and then a trip to PSG in the Champions League.
Tottenham saved some pride with a comeback point at home against United, even if they threw away the two points that would remarkably have put Frank's side in second place in the Premier League at that moment.
For even if it has been unconvincing stuff at times, Spurs have only lost three of their opening 11 games under the Dane in the Premier League and lost one more in the other six cup matches, another on penalties if you want to include the UEFA Super Cup.
They are the joint third highest scorers in the league and have conceded the joint fourth fewest goals, currently sitting fifth in a tight table.
So it's far from doom and gloom but there's still a hell of a lot of work to be done at Tottenham Hotspur and Thomas Frank is well aware of it.
